14:00:54 <Nihathrael> #startmeeting
14:00:54 <UH-Guard> Meeting started Sun Feb 27 14:00:54 2011 UTC.  The chair is Nihathrael. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00:54 <UH-Guard> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
14:01:02 <Nihathrael> #topic meetings
14:01:21 <Nihathrael> Ok, first point of the day. We should have regular meetings again
14:01:35 <Nihathrael> the question is if we can find a day that fits everyone
14:01:42 <totycro> weekly?
14:01:49 <Kilian]1> in the past we had meetings every wednesday
14:01:52 <Nihathrael> that would be another question
14:02:00 <totycro> but a jour fixe would be nice
14:02:07 <totycro> even if we only do it every 2 or 3 weeks
14:02:27 <Nihathrael> wednesday might work for me in the coming weeks (not this week though)
14:02:33 <Nightraven> Nihathrael: i can set up a quick doodle poll for finding the best day
14:02:37 <eoc> I'd vote for weekend � late wednesday evening is somethin not everybody has enough power to attend
14:02:57 <eoc> an earlier date as the current one also has a pro since you can work on some taskss afterwards
14:02:57 <Nihathrael> weekend is sometimes a little hard to plan
14:02:59 <Kilian]1> hi dauerflucher
14:03:01 <eoc> that's true.
14:03:02 <totycro> maybe everybody can quickly state which dates would work?
14:03:05 <Nihathrael> although we could try sunday evening or something like that
14:03:07 <totycro> erm, day of week
14:03:32 <eoc> hm, until university starts again that's not very regular for me
14:03:47 <totycro> me: monday, tuesday, thursday
14:03:55 <eoc> so I rather pick certain dates as 'no' than days of the week ;o
14:04:10 <eoc> hi UH-Guest_1
14:04:14 <UH-Guest_1> hi
14:04:19 <totycro> Nihathrael: ?
14:04:20 <totycro> dauerflucher: ?
14:04:28 <eoc> Kilian]1: ?
14:04:28 <totycro> Kilian]1: ?
14:04:31 <eoc> heh
14:04:40 <Kilian]1> i would vote for a day in the week
14:04:50 <eoc> let's continue that. kaschte Nightraven
14:04:53 <eoc> mssssm:
14:04:55 <dauerflucher> ?
14:04:55 <Nihathrael> yea, quite difficult to say. I'd guess sunday, monday, tuesday, thursday should work
14:05:00 <Nihathrael> wednesday could work
14:05:12 <totycro> any objections to tuesday?
14:05:12 <Nightraven> sunday, monday, tuesday for my part
14:05:22 <eoc> there exists a doodle tool for finding dates here
14:05:24 <Kilian]1> dauerflucher: say a date where you have time to talke part at a meeting
14:05:37 <eoc> #idea start a doodle to find days where most devs can attend
14:05:57 <Nightraven> http://www.doodle.com/niwn8mknnb3v49fy
14:06:06 <Nightraven> just take the dates as weekdays
14:06:09 <dauerflucher> actually you want me to say a day not a date, i guess
14:06:14 <Nightraven> (from monday to sunday)
14:06:42 <Nihathrael> dauerflucher: yep
14:06:56 <Nihathrael> ok, everyone can fill out the doodle and we'll take a loko at it at the end of the meeting
14:07:11 <Nihathrael> #topic GSoC
14:07:18 <Nihathrael> eoc: your call
14:07:29 <eoc> yeah, let me give a short overview at first
14:07:54 <eoc> gsoc is a project where google pays students to code for oss projects
14:08:05 <eoc> and we decided that we should at least apply for that program
14:08:30 <eoc> we need ideas for that since students are planned to do 12 weeks of coding
14:08:51 <eoc> a hort timeline (with important dates for us) is found here: http://wiki.unknown-horizons.org/w/Timeline_2011
14:08:56 <totycro> how realistic is it, that students will work for UH?
14:09:15 <eoc> if we are accepted by google, there will be enough
14:09:38 <eoc> I am somehow related to wesnoth and they in the past had a relation of about 4-5 applicants per idea slot
14:09:57 <eoc> we of course are smaller
14:10:09 <eoc> but I think it's quite realistic that we get enough interested students
14:10:21 <eoc> I mean, google pays $5'000 if they are successful
14:10:32 <eoc> that's not little money for 12 weeks work
14:10:45 <eoc> so our tasks now are *fill out the application info for google since the application timeframe starts tomorrow
14:10:46 <Nihathrael> we should apply for our own project :)
14:11:07 <eoc> * find mentors and ideas (mostly done, needs fleshing out of the ideas)
14:11:30 <manue|> mh
14:11:31 <eoc> I as organisation admin will be the person in contact for google
14:11:34 <manue|> 7.4 dollar per hour
14:11:40 <manue|> that's not much :D
14:11:55 <eoc> anything important I forgot now � hm
14:12:11 <Kilian]1> dont think so
14:12:19 <eoc> I'll have a chat with our mentors about what I expect them to do and how to handle certain situations later
14:12:24 <totycro> maybe we can quickly decide on the ideas now
14:12:24 <Nihathrael> What needs to be done on the Go-to developers page? I think we have everyone important on there
14:12:36 <eoc> yes that one is ready to go online
14:13:20 <eoc> okay, online now, thx Nihathrael
14:13:43 <Nihathrael> ok, what needs to be done on the application side?
14:14:01 <eoc> ah, the wesnoth connection maybe. I asked them if they would like to back us as a smaller project
14:14:29 <eoc> and they will now tell google that they think we're mature enough to participate
14:14:37 <eoc> hopefully that will work out well
14:14:45 <Nihathrael> nice
14:14:57 <eoc> I'll gather the remaining parts of text for our actual application next days
14:15:08 <eoc> that's mostly descriptions of our infrastructure
14:15:16 <Nihathrael> Is that 12 weeks of fulltime work?
14:15:18 <Nihathrael> (40h a week)
14:15:19 <eoc> and our plans of how to deal with arising problems
14:15:27 <eoc> yup, they estimate 40 hours
14:15:38 <Nihathrael> ok, tile set will never take 12 week the way it is now
14:15:54 <eoc> we added random maps there for this reason
14:15:55 <Nihathrael> we'll need to think of a lot more there if we want that to be 12weeks worth of work
14:16:22 <Kilian]> dont know how much time is needed to write a working AI
14:16:36 <eoc> and all ideas are set such that you can add new milestones or shift students' attention while the project is ongoing
14:16:57 <eoc> the student and we will provide two evaluations, one as midterm and one final
14:17:01 <Kilian]> looks like combat and Ai are the biggest tasks on the list
14:17:23 <Kilian]> http://wiki.unknown-horizons.org/w/Ideas_2011
14:17:39 <eoc> from my experience with wesnoth tasks, they tend to change over time and unexpected difficulties pop out of the blue
14:18:18 <eoc> they (and I totally gree there) rather want some project finished earlier and have enough time for documentation&testing than hurrying because 12 weeks are nearly over and nothing works
14:18:22 <totycro> i like the current list of ideas.. should we add/remove/alter anything?
14:18:45 <eoc> I thought about adding the "mp-fun" idea there as something where applicants could be creative and add own ideas
14:19:11 <eoc> our problem is that we lack enough mentors to ensure a sane supervision
14:19:50 <eoc> several guides estimate roughly 5 hours per week for the mentor and I think it's not viable to have more than two mentees
14:20:23 <eoc> currently totycro and Nihathrael volunteered to be mentors, I can't think of better mentors for UH
14:20:37 <eoc> but not of anybody besides them, too.
14:21:31 <totycro> is there more need for discussion, or should we conclude this topic?
14:21:39 <totycro> eoc: thx for the great work at that, btw :)
14:21:52 <eoc> what's the general opinion on the task "anything (besides the combat system) that adds multiplayer fun"?
14:22:23 <totycro> we could call that "general ui design improvements and additions"
14:22:27 <Kilian]> fog of war, but thats a task on the fife todo list ?!
14:22:29 <Nihathrael> I think it might be a nice idea
14:22:32 <totycro> and include a trade tab rework
14:22:38 <Nihathrael> if the students have good ideas that could add a lot of value to the game
14:22:39 <totycro> and other minor stuff that users like
14:22:48 <eoc> I think if somebody comes up with an own idea on what to add there (and most times these are the projects that are successful because students see it as their very own task)
14:22:54 <eoc> we shouldn't decline that
14:23:22 <eoc> ah, the fife topic
14:24:01 <eoc> I wanted to talk to the gsoc project head about if we could attract c++ devs to work on fife as UH-idea but unfortunately she's on vacation ;)
14:24:22 <eoc> so I'll still pursue this and hope to get something settled before ideas list 'closes'
14:24:28 <Nihathrael> there is still some time left
14:24:43 <eoc> (and of course I'll talk to prock / vtchill about if they could mentor such a task)
14:24:58 <eoc> okay. think that's it so far
14:25:13 <Nihathrael> alright, thanks
14:25:23 <Nihathrael> #topic Makin' it free
14:25:35 <Nihathrael> Kilian] how is the current state of this ongoing endevour
14:26:03 <Kilian]> theres only one sound left that have to be replaced
14:26:09 <Kilian]> then all sounds are free
14:26:22 <Kilian]> from gfx side there are some more problems
14:26:38 <Kilian]> all units (people) and the sheep are nonfree
14:26:39 <eoc> Kilian]: what about the branch office sound?
14:26:58 <Kilian]> thats the stuff where i know what are the sources
14:27:15 <Kilian]> but there are a lot of stuff where are no information about sources
14:27:26 <eoc> #link https://github.com/unknown-horizons/unknown-horizons/blob/de0a57e77ad372bfdef4381c9cef2c29098cc3a3/doc/LICENSE
14:27:56 <Kilian]> for example this file https://github.com/unknown-horizons/gfx/blob/master/dauerflucher/gui/misc/minimap_placeholder.png
14:28:17 <Kilian]> dauerflucher: is it your own work ?
14:28:19 <eoc> is that still used anywhere?
14:28:30 <Kilian]> dont think so
14:28:49 <totycro> is there sth to discuss or work to acctually distribute for this topic?
14:28:54 <dauerflucher> Kilian]: yapp
14:29:05 <Kilian]> there are also some textures where nobody knows where it comes from
14:29:17 <dauerflucher> but actually i do not have an idea, where this map is from
14:29:24 <eoc> it's Turkey from what I can tell :)
14:29:25 <dauerflucher> the one i used for the BG
14:29:33 <dauerflucher> yey, bosporus
14:30:27 <Kilian]> my idea was to find someone at opengameart who is able to make an animated man and woman we can use as basic model, and change there clothes to fit for every task
14:30:27 <eoc> yes, I also asked the "last" sampling+ sound file author if he could relicense it under by-sa 3 for us and got no response so far
14:30:30 <dauerflucher> generally i stick to free image sources, but i can't guarantee, because this was only a placeholder
14:30:46 <eoc> inken: would you be interested in that task? o:
14:30:53 <dauerflucher> is this image still used, Kilian]?
14:31:03 <eoc> dauerflucher: it isn't, I just grepped for it
14:31:04 <Kilian]> dauerflucher: no, dont think so
14:31:18 <eoc> I deleted it as part of my GUI folder cleanup
14:31:23 <dauerflucher> ok, good
14:31:38 <inken> eoc: what? i didn't follow the chat
14:31:45 <eoc> <Kilian]> my idea was to find someone at opengameart who is able to make an animated man and woman we can use as basic model, and change there clothes to fit for every task
14:31:59 <eoc> there are models on OGA which would suffice for us
14:32:19 <Kilian]> started already a request for a black/white sheep
14:32:24 <Nihathrael> ok so in summary we can say, sound is almost debian compatible, but gfx is still quite a problem
14:32:30 <Kilian]> right
14:32:53 <eoc> I thought about releasing a debian-version with all gfx replaced by something ugly
14:33:02 <eoc> to get attention for what we lack
14:33:05 <Nightraven> -debian
14:33:08 <Nihathrael> ok, i think that's enough for the meeting. Kilian] ŷou are already working on that right? Can you stick with this task and try to move it forward to free as much as possible
14:33:15 <eoc> do you think that's worth the efforts?
14:33:23 <Kilian]> and i could be possible that in our used buildings are textures that arent free, but cause of the fat we have no source information, we should take more thoughts about that
14:33:42 <Kilian]> *shouldnt
14:33:49 <Kilian]> btw
14:33:50 <eoc> #link http://www.opengameart.org/content/cleaned-up-base-human-models
14:33:53 <mssssm> back
14:33:56 <mssssm> ohai
14:34:17 <Kilian]> in my opinion we should link every external source in our license file
14:34:24 <eoc> #link http://opengameart.org/content/nude-male-skin-for-pfunkeds-base-human-models
14:34:50 <Kilian]> and everyone who upload files to the gfxrepo should make a small textfile with the license and source information
14:35:15 <Kilian]> something like this https://github.com/unknown-horizons/gfx/blob/master/old_source/hoehrer/license.txt
14:35:18 <Nihathrael> yes, that would be pretty good
14:35:48 <eoc> #idea  everyone who upload files to the gfxrepo should make a small textfile with the license and source information, cf. https://github.com/unknown-horizons/gfx/blob/master/old_source/hoehrer/license.txt
14:36:42 <Nihathrael> #task Kilian] will try to move UH further to a "free" as in debian free state
14:37:23 <Nihathrael> #topic Build menu
14:37:33 <Nihathrael> ok, so there was a lot of talk about the building menu this week
14:37:48 <Kilian]> http://wiki.unknown-horizons.org/w/Build_menu
14:38:03 <Nihathrael> various idea from changing the tabs to categories instead of settler increments
14:38:19 <Nihathrael> to having a menu which dynamically allocates the most used buildings
14:38:25 <Nihathrael> quite a lot came up
14:38:33 <kaschte> hi guys
14:38:39 <eoc> heya kaschte
14:38:51 <Nihathrael> another idea was to actually have a switch, so that each user can decide whether he wants it grouped by increment or category
14:39:26 <Nihathrael> I know we had this discussion before, but nobody really knows why we went with the increment approach anymore
14:39:43 <Nihathrael> dauerflucher: do you by any chance remember why this decision was made?
14:39:50 <eoc> kaschte: ^
14:40:19 <dauerflucher> no idea
14:40:40 <eoc> as a general statement, I think we should allow both and ask our players what they like best.
14:40:56 <Kilian]> eoc: yep
14:41:08 <kaschte> Nihathrael, the increment sorting was favored by me
14:41:20 <Nihathrael> the big difficulty with categories will be having good icons for the categories
14:41:20 <kaschte> in 1404 this works very well
14:41:21 <totycro> how about we create multiple concrete proposals of how to group stuff, think about it, and then have a vote?
14:41:28 <totycro> changing the grouping should be easy
14:41:36 <totycro> or, we could/should make the code in a way, that it's easy
14:41:37 <kaschte> whats wrong with it?
14:41:48 <totycro> like having a db that defines the placement
14:41:51 <eoc> totycro: an exclusive vote or something like 'the best three make it into the game'?
14:42:03 <totycro> a vote for the default
14:42:11 <eoc> ah, okay, that could work, yes
14:42:50 <Kilian]> is anyone against implementing both ideas ?
14:42:54 <eoc> I think we have to think about the grouping / categories anyways since we now display them in the build menu
14:43:09 <eoc> and once we agreed on a good categorisation, we can find icons for that
14:43:16 <Kilian]> right
14:43:30 <eoc> I'd however make clear that I still prefer sorting by increments as default :)
14:43:40 <Kilian]> the ursprungsidee was to autogenerate this buildmenu
14:43:43 <totycro> so we agree on making it dynamically changable, therefore eliminating the need for deciding on sth?
14:44:17 <Kilian]> yep, except for deciding what the default one of the both ^^
14:44:20 <Nihathrael> I'm not sure if that will be worth the effort
14:44:33 <eoc> imho it should work dynamically, yes. question: up to which degree (can scenario editor move around stuff for instance?)
14:44:33 <Nihathrael> having a completely dynamic menu for that will be a lot of work
14:44:46 <totycro> i'm thinking of a table that links categories and buildings of that categories
14:44:56 <totycro> and possibly which categories per tab
14:44:58 <Kilian]> Nihathrael: chew-ie did this already for us
14:45:41 <totycro> Nihathrael: if we use rather stupid code to decide the placement, that should be not so hard to implement
14:45:42 <Kilian]> he wrote a own buildmenu_uh pychan demo
14:45:56 <Kilian]> eoc: did u have the link ?
14:46:09 <eoc> nope, not at hands
14:46:16 <eoc> but I have the code :)
14:46:32 <Kilian]> same here
14:46:35 <Nihathrael> Yea ok, we can do that for the categories
14:46:37 <Nihathrael> that will work
14:46:38 <Kilian]> http://chewie.zero-projekt.net/div/1024x_uh_buildmenu.ogg but this is the video he made
14:46:48 <Nihathrael> the question is if that is flexible enough for us
14:47:09 <Nihathrael> but i guess it should
14:47:24 <Nihathrael> we could make the increments categories as well
14:47:37 <Nihathrael> that will be it nice and generalizable
14:47:57 <eoc> agreed
14:48:04 <Kilian]> same here
14:48:33 <Nihathrael> #agreed we will have a dynamic build menu, where categories for buildings can be set in a db so that a menu can be autogenerated. This should allow both sorting by type and by increment easily
14:48:44 <Nihathrael> #topic 2011.1
14:48:50 <Kilian]> mom
14:49:03 <Kilian]> what about tooltips ?
14:49:21 <Nihathrael> that's a different topic, but we can talk about that later
14:49:29 <Kilian]> okay
14:49:43 <Nihathrael> Ok 2011.1, the question is when are we plannig to release the next version
14:49:55 <Nihathrael> it would probably be good to have it in time with gsoc
14:50:04 <eoc> I'd say that soc applicants should be able to play a recent version
14:50:06 <Nihathrael> that would be march 18
14:50:08 <eoc> to get the UH feeling
14:50:24 <totycro> hmm.. we still have to fix a few bugs
14:50:29 <totycro> test the boatbuilder
14:50:31 <totycro> make mines a bit nicer
14:50:36 <eoc> I yesterday tried to mark them totycro
14:50:45 <Nihathrael> we need to fix the fisher as well
14:50:49 <eoc> http://trac.unknown-horizons.org/t/query?status=assigned&status=new&status=reopened&component=!Management&component=!Wiki&component=!Website&milestone=2011.1&group=status&col=id&col=summary&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&col=component&col=time&order=priority&report=10
14:51:03 <eoc> these are tasks I'd consider for 2011.1
14:51:56 <totycro> btw: this view is broken: http://trac.unknown-horizons.org/t/report/3
14:52:31 <eoc> totycro: I'd say #772 #790 are important to have
14:52:35 <Nihathrael> eoc: I think we should be able to get most of that fixed
14:52:53 <eoc> Nihathrael: also #771 and #760
14:53:02 <eoc> since these currently bork our fish placement and the fisher
14:53:05 <totycro> imo, that list plus fisher is the plan for the milestone
14:53:22 <Nihathrael> yes
14:53:33 <Nihathrael> so shall we setthat for march18?
14:53:48 <totycro> i'm not sure how much time i will have till then
14:53:53 <Nihathrael> I guess next release after that would be containing all gsoc code, or midterm code
14:53:58 <Kilian]> #774 wpuld prevent use to have a lot of people who have problems with the multiplayer ...
14:53:59 <totycro> the gsoc people can use the git version anyways
14:54:05 <totycro> they should be able to do that
14:54:11 <eoc> agreed.
14:54:28 <eoc> but to get in touch with UH, they should also have a fairly recent release
14:54:32 <Nihathrael> never the less, a current release makes it look active
14:54:40 <Kilian]> right
14:54:43 <eoc> consider students that are unsure about whether they want to work with us
14:54:46 <totycro> Kilian]: playing with the same version should work in general
14:54:53 <eoc> I won't be around from march 6 -- march 16, exams
14:55:12 <totycro> eoc: installing fife svn and uh git is really not hard
14:55:16 <Kilian]> totycro: but not with not the same version, and nobody of the players knows that
14:55:25 <totycro> a developer has experience with such stuff anyways
14:55:37 <Nightraven> totycro: report fixed :)
14:55:44 <Nihathrael> mh i will not be available 20.3-27.3
14:55:46 <eoc> we don't aim for devs that know everything about vsc etc.
14:56:05 <eoc> many people in soc have programming experience but never before worked in a team
14:56:15 <eoc> thus are unsure about what svn and git can do
14:56:29 <totycro> k.. so i agree that it would be nice to have a release by then, but i still maintain that we might not make it
14:56:31 <Nihathrael> totycro: it's not about them not being able to do it, but to make them feel confident that the project is ongoing and that there code will be released to the public in a timely manner
14:56:53 <totycro> k, i'm convinced :)
14:57:35 <Nihathrael> #agreed We will try to get release 2011.1 out for GSOC on March 18th
14:57:57 <Nihathrael> #link http://trac.unknown-horizons.org/t/query?status=assigned&status=new&status=reopened&component=!Management&component=!Wiki&component=!Website&milestone=2011.1&group=status&col=id&col=summary&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&col=component&col=time&order=priority&report=10
14:57:58 <totycro> or at least we could make a "pre release"
14:58:03 <Nihathrael> yep
14:58:12 <totycro> without ubuntu packages, or stuff like that
14:58:13 <Nihathrael> #topic website updates
14:58:16 <eoc> better than nothing, clearly
14:58:25 <Nihathrael> Nightraven your call
14:58:35 <Nightraven> Ok then
14:58:50 <Nightraven> I recently migrated, merged and fixed some things on our scripts
14:59:03 <Nightraven> to give you all a short overview:
14:59:58 <Nightraven> trac and pootle are now running with a mysql database in the backend. This should make them a bit faster + we now have the ability to show things directly on our website (latest n tickets for example)
15:00:30 <Nightraven> the git plugin is back again. Including a repository browser that now supports branches and tags
15:00:48 <Nightraven> and there is a possibilty now to manage custom fields for tickets via the webpanel
15:01:18 <Kilian]> what about pootle, does it works again ?
15:01:32 <Nightraven> pootle is synced with the git repository again and it works completely
15:01:42 <Kilian]> okay, fine
15:01:48 <Nightraven> including mail stuff at pootle and trac
15:02:03 <eoc> I will update the tutorial scenario templates today
15:02:13 <Nightraven> And now a little bigger topic
15:02:15 <eoc> the UI files are uploaded so far
15:02:31 <eoc> (thanks for all that work Nightraven)
15:02:45 <Nightraven> i will start to change the main site to a new cms
15:03:08 <Nightraven> it is called phpoint and as the name says also based on php but much much more reliable than the cmsms crap we use currently
15:03:27 <Nightraven> means it will not bork the whole page after each update + crash all plugins
15:03:47 <totycro> Nightraven: is that worth the effort?
15:04:21 <Nightraven> totycro: actually you cant risk a update of cmsms without fearing that you will have to switch each and every plugin after the upgrade
15:04:39 <Nightraven> because of incompatibilites or plugins that are not maintained anymore
15:05:26 <Nightraven> + phpoint is much more developer friendly because it is designed for plugins the way a nerd would imagine :D
15:06:59 <Nightraven> Ok so far that are all updates, questions, ideas or wishes?
15:07:29 <Nihathrael> sounds cool to me
15:07:40 <Nihathrael> will our current design work with the new cms?
15:07:45 <Kilian]> the favicon at the forum is missing :D
15:07:49 <eoc> only the main page is going to be migrated iiuc?
15:08:01 <kaschte> Nightraven, is it this? http://www.phpoint.de/
15:08:13 <eoc> Kilian]: also at trac by the way
15:08:14 <Nightraven> eoc: main page including blog, galler and all including stuff
15:08:41 <Nightraven> kaschte: yup :)
15:08:50 <kaschte> and this is better than cmsms?
15:08:57 <kaschte> i mean, where is the website?
15:09:09 <kaschte> documentation has 3 pages
15:09:13 <Nightraven> it is a system that is atm not publicly released
15:09:29 <Nightraven> + i know the author
15:09:47 <kaschte> ok, this will be a lot of work to do
15:10:13 <Nightraven> he supports me at migrating all stuff and he can use us at a reference :)
15:10:15 <kaschte> and as niha said it, is it worth the work?
15:10:33 <kaschte> are there any plugins?
15:10:39 <kaschte> blog gallery?
15:10:51 <Nightraven> newssystem yes
15:10:57 <Nightraven> gallery in a basic version
15:11:32 <Nihathrael> It has to provide everything we have now
15:11:37 <Nihathrael> in the same quality or better basically
15:11:42 <Nihathrael> otherwise it's not worth any effort
15:11:45 <Nightraven> it will
15:11:46 <kaschte> i dont understand your probs with cmsms
15:11:49 <Nightraven> let that be my problem :)
15:12:04 <kaschte> ok
15:13:34 <Nihathrael> ok, so you work on that. We're only gonna swap when it's done anyway
15:13:54 <Nightraven> thats the plan
15:14:10 <Nihathrael> ok, those were the regular points for this meeting
15:14:15 <Nihathrael> #topic Tooltips
15:14:17 <Nihathrael> Kilian]: ?
15:14:22 <Kilian]> yeah
15:15:07 <Kilian]> made some thoughts about the buildmenu and realised that, we havnt any xmls files for the tabs where we can input our texts for the tooltips
15:15:31 <Kilian]> so we can move tooltips to a new small database or as niha said in a yaml file
15:15:53 <totycro> why not put them in the gui (xml) file as we do now?
15:16:24 <eoc> the xml file will be empty concerning buildings
15:16:41 <Nightraven> just to avoid misunderstandings you are talking about this little text popups that appear when you hover over sth?
15:16:42 <eoc> so that doesn't feel like an intuitive place to look for them
15:16:44 <Kilian]> totycro: because we only started editing the buildmenu to make a auotgenerated one, becasue its really hard to edit 50 lines of code onyl to add one icon ...
15:16:45 <eoc> yep
15:17:16 <totycro> so are we talking about the same tooltip as TooltipButton, etc. ?
15:17:35 <eoc> basically about the tooltips for the tooltipbuttons in our build menu
15:17:39 <eoc> and only about these
15:18:28 <Kilian]> but then we have to think about moving all tolltips at one place or some into the xmls files and that one for the buildmenu in a yaml/db
15:18:35 <totycro> well, currently, there is not set_tooltip() method, but sth like that can easily be implemented, the data can come from anywhere
15:18:56 <eoc> I personally think that we should delay this discussion until we have a modular build menu
15:19:06 <eoc> else everybody has something different in mind when arguing
15:19:07 <Kilian]> okay
15:19:15 <totycro> what about the general tooltip code?
15:19:25 <totycro> there are still some issues, aren't there?
15:19:31 <Nihathrael> I would suggest we have a general tooltip table/file
15:19:35 <Nihathrael> for all tooltips
15:19:40 <eoc> heh. no comment from my side but http://trac.unknown-horizons.org/t/ticket/714
15:19:51 <totycro> wouldn't that be hard to link to the acctual gui elements?
15:20:12 <Nihathrael> totycro: not quite sure, could be
15:20:17 <totycro> it seems cumbersome to me to always have to edit a special file/db if you want to add a tooltip for your label
15:20:54 <eoc> I think the current way works
15:20:58 <eoc> as long as you have an xml file
15:21:07 <eoc> setting tooltips in python files is something where I'd object
15:21:17 <eoc> even if the widget is set there as well
15:21:30 <Nihathrael> well we can of course put the tooltip for the buildings into a table
15:21:36 <Nihathrael> and autoload themfor the buildmenu
15:21:38 <eoc> for translations there is no difference by the way.
15:21:41 <Nihathrael> as a buildmenu only solution
15:21:42 <totycro> the whole tooltip code is like 50 lines, btw
15:22:34 <eoc> we can always add this to our SoC task about gui improvements.
15:24:51 <totycro> so basically: whoever is going to implement the dynamic build menu should figure sth out?
15:25:07 <eoc> should ask again once the issue is urgent
15:25:35 <totycro> k, so that would conclude this.. Nihathrael ?
15:26:56 <Nihathrael> ok
15:27:03 <Nihathrael> yea i guess that goes with the build menu in a way then
15:27:15 <Nihathrael> #topic ORR
15:27:18 <Nihathrael> Nightraven
15:27:56 <Nightraven> Ok really quick thing because i have not much time left
15:28:29 <eoc> christoph: ping
15:28:30 <Nightraven> This year again is the thing hat worked so wonderful without unknown-horizon last year
15:28:35 <Nightraven> called OpenRheinRuhr
15:28:57 <Nightraven> I would suggest that we organise sth this year
15:29:11 <Nightraven> actually i could get everything we need there
15:29:56 <Nightraven> it would only need at least two people or more that sit there and answer questions
15:30:15 <Kilian]> dont know if i have time then, cause its really far away
15:30:34 <Nightraven> i will be around but i won't have the time to hang around at a project desk :p
15:30:58 <eoc> if we plan for two days, I'll either only take one or need some cheap hostel :P
15:31:16 <eoc> stuff is travelling 4 hours per train for me
15:31:28 <Nihathrael> I won't be available, i'll be norway from august to at least december
15:31:37 <eoc> and nobody seems to like orr around here
15:31:43 <totycro> it's too far for me, and i'm generally rather busy..
15:31:47 <Nightraven> me afk now as i said ... no time anymore
15:33:34 <Kilian]> looks like sunday would be a good day for meeting http://www.doodle.com/niwn8mknnb3v49fy
15:33:35 <totycro> proposal: Nightraven seems to be the to-go guy for this, maybe he can try to find people for this, and those people can then figure out what to do exactly
15:33:54 <totycro> Nihathrael: #topic meetings ?
15:34:14 <Nihathrael> ok
15:34:18 <Nihathrael> #topic meetings
15:34:39 <Nihathrael> looks like sunday
15:34:42 <Nihathrael> http://www.doodle.com/niwn8mknnb3v49fy
15:34:43 <Kilian]> i will also have time at sunday
15:35:04 <Nihathrael> so shall we try to do this on sunday evening
15:35:08 <Nihathrael> like 8:00pm
15:35:24 <totycro> Kilian]: can you make it sometimes at sunday?
15:35:39 <Kilian]> evening should be okay
15:35:54 <eoc> possibly too late for me, I'll have tutorials on mondays around 8am
15:35:56 <totycro> well then, great
15:36:17 <totycro> so maybe 6pm ?
15:37:05 <eoc> anything as long as I get a bit sleep ;o
15:37:13 <Nihathrael> 6pm sounds ok
15:37:20 <eoc> 6 will be okay
15:37:22 <Kilian]> okay
15:37:37 <totycro> how often do we want meetings?
15:38:07 <Nihathrael> i think it would be nice if we try to have one every week
15:38:15 <eoc> I'm not sure if we also will have separate soc meetings and weekly will thus be too often
15:38:18 <Nihathrael> even if it's only to get the team together and discuss different things
15:38:28 <eoc> but in general: agree with Nihathrael
15:38:48 <Kilian]> weekly meeting was fine in the past
15:39:19 <totycro> so more, possibly short meetings... well, we can try that
15:39:41 <Nihathrael> yea i guess that'll be nice
15:39:56 <Nihathrael> if it doesn't work out we can try to go to every two weeks
15:40:49 <eoc> okay. I'll now get rid of everything we discussed on our next_meeting page. also added it to the navbar in our wiki
15:40:55 <totycro> fine with me -- how about we try to finish the meeting soon?
15:41:10 <Nihathrael> ok, i guess we're doen with this meeting then
15:41:23 <Nihathrael> #agreed Regualar meeting every sunday at 18pm gmt+1
15:41:29 <Nihathrael> any further ponits?
15:42:13 <Nihathrael> #endmeeting